Video Infoblog: Even If They Invade Rafah, Israel Still Can’t Win the Larger War

 

 

Transcript

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we need a new system we need a new Society we need to demand that which may

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have sounded impossible even a few weeks ago but is not only realizable but an

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imperative

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[Music] necessity does the Israeli Killing Spree

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in Gaza signal a turning point in the struggle of the Palestinian people for National

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Liberation will this be remembered as the era of National Liberation for a

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people who were driven from their homes from their Villages starting 75 years

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ago and repeatedly since have we entered a new stage in the struggle for

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Palestinian Freedom welcome to the Socialist program I'm your host Brian

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Becker today we're talking with Muhammad nbuli he is an organizer with the Palestinian youth movement and an

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attorney based in Houston Texas Muhammad welcome back to the show thank you for having me

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again uh Muhammad history is filled with all sorts of ironies I you can't look at

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Gaza and not come to the conclusion that this appears to be the darkest moment uh

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for the people of Palestine certainly for the people of Gaza the genocide the killing of 30,000 plus people thousands

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and thousands of children and their moms the destruction of so many homes and at the same time the global

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outrage against the genocide has become I believe a material factor in the

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overarching movement for Palestinian Freedom the Israeli government and its us sponsor are completely isolated we

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have recordings from the so-called Anti-Defamation League and I'm going to read a little bit of a transcript these

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are the pro Zionist sort of propaganda units in inside the United States who

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believe that the the public opinion has turned so decidedly in the United States

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that it's a huge what they call a major major major problem I'm going to go over some of that transcript but anyway I

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want to get your take first on this and of course uh as as you mentioned the last time you were on the show we are in

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Ramadan now so the stakes of a of a bigger expanding struggle uh couldn't be

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higher yeah I think um within the context of the Palestinian struggle the

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osel Accords brought in a period of lull of pacification of uh depletion of

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resistance and resistance forces throughout Palestine and in the region and that period um essentially produced

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conditions of repression and Siege for Palestinians wherever they were and it's

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through those conditions um the maximalist strategies that the Israelis pursued especially the far right that we

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see the birth of a new um phase in the Palestinian struggle and October 7th

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sort of marked a peak uh of escalation and since that moment what we've seen is

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the contradictions that have emerged as a result of this pursuit of a maximalist

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expansion by the Israelis uh their desire to completely subjugate the Palestinians has actually uh engendered

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new resistance especially amongst younger generations and it's not just younger Generations in Palestine um that

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have sort of rose up it's throughout the entire region right uh and we've seen

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the emergence of a resistance strategy throughout the region from various forces that are aligned on a struggle

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against imperialism understanding that the US and the West's broadly domination of the region must come to an end and it

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can only come to an end through actual confrontation with their interests and their aspirations in the region now on a

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global stage this emergence of resistance by youth by younger

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Generations has been paralleled by the younger Generations throughout the

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Palestinian diaspora within the west and we've seen especially on the level of

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gen Z Millennials these younger Generations uh a Clarity for them on the

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stakes of the Palestinian struggle their role in it their participation in it their understanding of the propaganda

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that's being uh deployed throughout mainstream media and um at the podiums

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of the White House this Clarity has resulted in my opinion in a qualitative

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shift amongst younger generations and even those Beyond those generations and an understanding of what the struggle

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requires of us a need to build revolutionary Consciousness and movement within the West in order to actually

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confront imperialism not just wherever it U strikes but also where it starts

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where it's launched which is obviously what we call the belly of the Beast and so this this parallel emergence of

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resistance globally is one that began to be built decades ago and I think we had

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various iterations of struggle in Palestine thei in tiala various

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uprisings that have taken place over the last six years and similarly in the US we've seen Occupy Wall Street the

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anti-war movement during the Iraq period um the uprisings against uh police

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brutality and violence and so this accumulation of experience infrastructure resources skills all has

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culminated in this moment where we're able to actually capitalize on a period

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that allows for qualitative shift and so that's where we're at now with Ramadan the last Point um that you mentioned I

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think we've already started to see um sort of the consequences the Israelis

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themselves for a variety of reasons uh including the fact that Ramadan is upon us have essentially delayed their ground

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invasion of Gaza now they've used they've signaled various excuses for that but we can get into it a little

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further my read of why they haven't yet invaded ra but I think Ramadan brings

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first of all Millions upon millions of Muslims into mosques who will be

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listening to sermons daily on the plight of Palestinians and the need for the

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Muslim world to mobilize in defense and support of Palestine uh it'll also bring

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um heightened attention to the fact that Palestinians are starving in the Gaz of strip so like there will be a

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visceral empathy from people fasting that will understand the need to

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actually bring this genocide to an end so all of these things I think and obviously coupled with the fact that the

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region can at any moment escalate um in confrontation with imperialism and the

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Israeli State itself I think brings us into a new period of this genocide one

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that I think will ultimately bring it to an end let's talk about this new mass

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movement and I'm I'm glad you mentioned and and made the point that the the Palestinian Youth and the the

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diaspora have such Clarity and are taking the lead uh in the last months

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since October 7th um I know in the shut it down for Palestine Coalition I'm in the answer

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Coalition we've organized uh collectively Mass marches

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in Washington of hundreds of thousands twice on November 4th and then later on January 13th people have disrupted

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traffic on Bridges they've disrupted businesses uh politicians can't go out

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and and U talk anywhere without being disrupted including the president of the United States uh college campuses have

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been a flame with protest uh student groups being repressed by administrations and yet the protests

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continue when you look at this whole sort of extreme level of activity in the

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last five months Palestinian young people have been at the center of it

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Palestinian young people have been in the lead ership for those of us who are not Palestinian we've been working in

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partnership in Alliance sort of in united front in Coalition but all around

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the country uh young Palestinians have been sort of the Detonator for these

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other young people I mean in America in a multinational Society a multiethnic

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society um you know certain parts of the population at at at times become the

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leadership they become the Deton ators for others certainly in the black civil rights movement which became a global or

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globalized youth movement in the United States globalized in the sense that it was Universal young white people young

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Latinos young asian-americans were there but it was young black people who were

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really the leadership in many ways they were the detonators they were the catalysts and then the rest of the

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population joined in but there was this divide between young and old with certain groups able to for historic IAL

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reasons take the leadership that's actually what we've witnessed for the past 6 months that's new in American

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politics I mean there have been Palestine actions and solidarity for a couple decades they got they were pretty

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small at first got bigger but this level of activism and Leadership from young

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people in the Palestinian diaspora that's one of the re really remarkable qualities of what's going

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on yeah no I agree with you and I think like it it must be situated in a context of

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Decades of building of organization um and that's what's important here so this movement this mobilization of

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Palestinian youth is not spontaneous nor is it reactive it's not something that

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is coming out of nowhere it in fact you have organizations that have essentially

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primed young organizers Palestinians and non-p Palestinians um to to think about

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um organizing mobilization movement direct action in a way that requires

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strong organization structure it um connections to community networks things

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of that nature and that work has spent you know especially since the rise of

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the students student movement especially the students for justice in Palestine um that work took decades to build and it

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took a lot of experimenting around politics around um tactics that

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culminated in this moment and and so for Pym the Palestinian youth movement specifically this is years in the making

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and 2021 was sort of our first moment where we entered the scene on a national

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level across various locations to confront Zionism Beyond sort of the the

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the spontaneous protest that would take place over the last 10 years um and for

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Pym since 2021 it's essentially building up the capacity to prepare for this moment you know reflecting on my own

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life uh I've I first became seriously involved in organizing following the

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2014 war in Gaza and so now we're we're 10 years from that moment 2014 resulted

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in a qualitative shift for my own understanding of the world as a young Palestinian at the time I was 20 21

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years old and I was faced with this brutality though it lasted a lot shorter

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than what we're experiencing now that changed the way I thought about the world and ever since then I entered into

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organization my politics sharpened my skill set sharpened my connections and networks with various groups increased

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and so imagine that happening on a mass scale with Palestinian youth wherever

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they are Palestinian Arab Youth and not just Palestinian Arab youth like we said the the youth who surround them also

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experiencing these shifts and so 10 years into

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building this genocide 10 years of honing myself and

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honing our organizations produced our capacity to respond to this moment in 2021 or I'm sorry in 2024 and so now

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what we're seeing is even on a greater scale this qualitative shift for new generations new youth who for the first

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time are being faced with the the mask off of us Empire and of uh Zionist

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settler colonialism in a way they've never seen before and now I can anticipate that this movement that was

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built at various junctures you know its foundation so to speak built in various junctures now is building off that

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foundation and raising the political ceiling for what it means to struggle against imperialism and

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Zionism real change in uh Society Muhammad whether it's reforms

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far-reaching reforms or even reforms that are not far-reaching but important

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or other more radical Transformations and even revolutions they happen really as a consequence of

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multiple factors but one of the key ingredients is what's going on below

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what's going on with the masses of people what's going on in terms of people's thinking their Consciousness

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you know some people I think misread the social justice movement or the radical movement however one wants to you know

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call it and think that our real Target is some politician in some office or

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some corporate executive or the president where what we know from a

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historical sort of assessment of how change happens is that change ultimately

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at any one of those levels from reform to Revolution happens when the people change it's when the people become

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actors when the people become conscious when they enter the historical onto the historical stage and then there is no

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power greater you know you can say power to the people but there is really the greatest power in the people once the

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people have started to move and I think that's what's happening uh and as you

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have described it so accurately that this is a it's not just about Palestine

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even though Palestine at the moment is the Catalyst there was occupi there was the black lives matter movement there

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was the anti-war movement the anti-globalization movement all of these the movement Against Racism uh and

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police violence after the killing of George Floyd all of these things have been happening and these movements AB

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been flowing but what's most important is are there organizers are there cadr are there

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organizations that have stained power so that even when a movement es and all

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mass movements go up and down when it es there's some vessel so that there's a

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collective memory so it's not all starting from scratch once again and we

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see this all over the country I want to play a couple video clips because as we're as we're talking right now

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organizers Palestinian Young Arab Americans and non-arab Americans non-p

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Palestinians are shutting down San Francisco airport or parts of it and then I want to show another clip from

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from yesterday in Cleveland uh and then I want to talk about how the bisi the

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ruling class the big political thinkers so to speak are trying to describe or

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characterize this Rising tide of Youth resistance which again I think is

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fundamentally false anyway let's play this first clip this is I think San Francisco's airport today Wednesday as

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we're as we're

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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speaking okay so okay that's that's San Francisco there are a lot of protests in

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San Francisco uh but there's been this intensifying level of protest almost every day let's

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go to another part of the country let's go to Cleveland Ohio not a hot bed of radicalism by any stretch this is what

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activists did in Cleveland yesterday let's play this clip this is Dallas PSL

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you can see behind me this is the highway right next to the airport directly behind us that is Cleveland

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International Airport you can see that the police have shut down the entrance as we brought our Caravan here we have

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hundreds and hundreds of vehicles hundreds of cars that have shut down this highway our cor Caravan has taken

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over this entire Highway Plaza and palar um Cleveland San

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Francisco um you know speaking of the bisi or the capitalists I want to

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mention Nikki Haley because according to Nikki Haley Muhammad the reason there's

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been all of this uh change in Consciousness is because of Tik Tock and

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uh Tik Tock was uh on the house floor today overwhelmingly uh they voted that unless

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the Chinese company parent company sells to an American Technology Company of

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course uh Tik Tock will be banned there's 170 million us users of Tik Tok

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almost all of them young so here's Nikki Haley Muhammad we really do need to ban

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Tik Tock once and for all and let me tell you why for every 30 minutes that

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someone watches Tik Tok every day they become 177% more anti-semitic very

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precise numbers here 17% more anti-semitic more pramas based on doing

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that so uh that's Nikki Haley's assessment um

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the ADL Anti-Defamation League there's a leak tape that's making the rounds

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online uh the head I think his name is Jason goldblat was talking to other

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supporters of Israel about the problem that we have he says I also want to point out that we have a major major

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major generational problem all the polling I've seen adl's polling icc's

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polling independent polling suggests this is not a left right Gap folks this

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is the issue of the United States support for Israel is not left and right it is young and old and the numbers of

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young people who think that hamas's you know Massacre was Justified is

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shockingly and terrifyingly High um Now by that what he means the mass

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opposition of young people to the genocide being committed by the Israeli uh government the Israeli

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military against the people of Gaza this Mass Uprising is nobody's saying yeah

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we're all for the so-called Massacre on October 7th the point is all of these

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people are recognizing that there's a problem but they're not locating the problem their problem the problem of

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young people moving away politically uh from the right channel go

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ahead yeah I think they um they're obviously reacting to the weakening of

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their hegemony over Pro the like the narrative right their capacity to be able to manufacture consent for their

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Wars for their genocides for their policies and I think what they don't

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recognize is that this change uh amongst youth the shift didn't start because of Tik

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Tock it started because of the actual mobilization into the streets right and

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that goes back years so Palestinians Pro Palestine activists have been building

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with other struggles and other youth who are working on their own issues like we said with black lives matter and it's

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through these connections that have been built the development of a shared politics right where we understand each

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other's struggles in a much better way that is allowed for youth for this to

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actually uh expand amongst younger generations and now that's reflected

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also in their platforms and you have to understand the actual creators the

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content producers on Tik Tok or social media sites are people themselves are these youth right and so it's not a

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centralized um sort of production that takes place where the Chinese Communist party or some nefarious force that they

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want to to blame is Gathering people together setting an agenda on what they should propagate and then dis dis uh

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actually like directing them to move in that way that's actually what happens with us mainstream media right like the

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US mainstream media is a controlled operation a few corporations tied to the

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ruling class in a very direct way are the ones who are able to curate and then put forward content their problems with

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Tik Tok is their inability to do that with this platform and their inability to control what youth are producing not

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just consuming right so it's not a problem of consumption here it's a problem of the fact that young

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Generations are able to actually put forward politics create knowledge right

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um do their own work to understand the world around them and to connect the dots between what this government thinks

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and says and what is actually happening so I think that is where they're they're

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uh failing I think whether or not this actually passes the Senate after the

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house voted on it is inconsequential to the sea change that we're seeing because

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ultimately those who are involved in organizing the younger generation that

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tends Progressive that leans Progressive itself right is not going to abandon its

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values because they no longer have a platform they're going to continue to engage other people their age that are

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forwarding politics and they see themselves young Generations as enlisted

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in a lifetime of work towards struggle and that's what's important in the organizations that exists around the the

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us around the West more broadly are now absorbing these youth are actually placing them in and refining and

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improving their understanding of the world and their understanding of what struggle actually requires of them and

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so I'm optimistic that regardless of what this ruling class may try to do

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this younger generation which they won't be able to capture um will uh find new

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ways to actually engage in knowledge production and organize themselves for a better

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world and when you think about what's happening to young people in Palestine

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Muhammad uh and of course this is then generating out to people in the

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diaspora uh the young fighters in the last few months they're probably in

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their early 20s that's you know the typical age well those people were just

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little kids in 2008 uh when the Israeli massacre in

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Gaza was so you know also began to get indignation and outrage from the

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world but not at this level if you if you eliminate and kill 15,000 kids or

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20,000 kids or 25,000 kids in their moms uh you're not going to kill

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everyone but those people who live the siblings they're going to want to fight

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they're going to be a little older maybe when they have the capacity to fight sort of arms and hand but they're not

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going to disappear I mean the only way Israel could actually succeed is have a

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complete genocide it seems to me that the the question of Palestine is

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so imbued with the consciousness of the Palestinian people that this actually as

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a material factor in the struggle usually you associate the struggle of for National Liberation with the land

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question whose land is it you know is it the colonizers or not in the case of the

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Palestinians when they've been driven from their land to all parts of the world the Consciousness about the

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Homeland hasn't actually shifted it's gone through stages and phases but it's not diminished in fact the Palestinian

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people as an entity exist in many ways because of this consciousness of struggle and so when you kill this many

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people this many civilians this many children and their mothers that's a

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recipe not for the end of the Palestinian people but for greater resistance that's why this that's why

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the Zionist sort of projection is like a fantasy uh I want to I want to talk to

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you about that and then I want to come back and ask you what you think about the US orientation towards

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uh not just the Israeli War but Israel itself uh but let's start with this other element that it's impo it's

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impossible really for the zionists to to defeat the Palestinian people because of

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the nature of Palestinian Consciousness and

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resistance yeah and so I think what people don't really understand about the

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Palestinian struggle is given that it's 75 years in the making if not actually long longer right we're talking about

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before that resistance to British colonialism is the Palestinian national identity emerged and was

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forged in a phase of resistance in a context of resistance and so the central

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facets the central tenants to Palestinian identity both religious in the sense of this is a large Muslim vast

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majority Muslim population even the understanding of Islam and the principles in the same way that we would think about for example the black church

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in the world of black church played uh during the Civil Rights Movement right the articulation of liberation theology

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and so that being born out of the conditions of the black uh people and their struggle uh and so that imbued

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within it uh understanding and articulation of even theology that relates to resistance or the need to

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overcome oppression right and so Palestinian culture Palestinian uh

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religious institutions and how they understand whether it's Christian or Muslim uh Palestinian dance

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music art whatever it might be reflects an identity that's rooted in

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a firm understanding of their conditions right that this is a struggle over land

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this is a struggle for rights of a people a struggle for self-determination at the same time it actually articulates

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the path needed for us to forge and take in order to achieve actual Justice

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Liberation and dignity you hear this in the chance like and I always think about

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when I listen to Palestinian music or where I where I hear the chants that come out of Palestine the actual

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sophistication of the politics the depth of the politics and something as basic as a song reflects to me the spe the

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undying Spirit of our struggle that I can listen to a song that was produced 60 years ago and it still speaks to my

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conditions today or that a song can be produced today and reflects experience from 70 years ago and that this is

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actually a Ross the diaspora and in fact if you look at the like the what the

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diaspora has brought to the scene in the US right or in the in the west or wherever the diaspora is are the term

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Liberation the term dignity the term Martyrs and martyrdom

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right the notion of armed struggle all of these politics all of these Concepts

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that are Central to anti-colonialism and anti-imperialism are often absent from

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the domestic struggles of the US right you don't hear a the struggle of you

28:33

know whatever it might be population as a struggle for dignity or a struggle for national uh Liberation or

28:40

self-determination or that the the people who are assassinated in the streets of this country are Martyrs for

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example at the hands of the state I think the Palestinian like even that Spirit these Concepts that are Central

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to understanding who we are and what we need to do in order to liberate ourselves are now being introduced to

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new audiences and being adopted by those audiences and we're seeing the backlash from the mainstream media early on when

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the students at George I want to say in in Virginia I don't remember exactly the school it might have been uh George Washington University when they

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broadcast glory to our Martyrs on a building on a university building there was a suspension of the SJP the students

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there was a targeting specific students right and there was this Fierce backlash by mainstream pundit over the fact that

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martyrdom in martyr was being used we saw this also in the conversation around Aon Bushnell right um the the attempt to

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effectively sap any meaning of his Act without recognizing that actually the people in Palestine who

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have now named the street after him the people in Yemen who now carry banners of him wherever they go have now adopted

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him as a martyr as a symbol of our struggle and so this transnational building of a spirit

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around anti-imperialism and anti-colonialism is now being uh actualized and speaks to the impact of

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the Palestine movement the Palestinian struggle the fact that it can serve as a lens by which we understand our own

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world our own realities and our own struggles and that is the contribution of the Palestinian struggle to the world

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that is the internationalization of Palestinian struggle but not just the internationalization of Palestinian

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struggle the internationalism of anti-imperialism and anti-colonialism and it's

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domestic I don't know what the word might be but the bringing of it to a domestic context right andb imbuing

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within it an understanding that the world around you the immediate world around you relates to the struggle of

30:42

Palestinians indeed I think those are extremely important points you know our show is called the Socialist program and

30:48

from the beginning of socialism um beginning with the utopian socialists or

30:54

the scientific socialists or the Socialist of the second International or the third international during this

30:59

entire epic where socialism has become a a political movement with different

31:05

iterations the idea that it's not simply a national movement but it is a profoundly International movement has

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been a Cornerstone during all the different stages and phases um and it's really just Central

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to socialism today uh Muhammad we're not using the same language that would have

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been used a 100 years ago or even 50 years ago people don't talk about imperialism in the colon IED world

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because many of the colon colonies have become at least legally uh independent

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entities uh we talk about we don't even use language from the 60s like the third world versus imperialism Etc we're using

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language like Global North and Global South and all of these terms especially when they're associated with a geography

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like something's in the west or something's in the North or something's in the East or the South it can be a

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little bit misleading even though generally speaking everybody gets the main point the the idea that somebody

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like Aaron Bushell an active duty member of the US Air

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Force uh could take his own life at the Israeli

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Embassy uh in line with the martyrdom of those who are fighting and resisting and

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those who are just targeted because they're they're Palestinians and have been targeted by the Israeli military

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the fact that he as a as a white American Service member could have a

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street named after him in Palestine or in Yemen it's an indicator of the

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profoundly you know underlying internationalism of the Palestinian

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struggle and when you think about National Liberation movements this is always been a Hallmark of the viable

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National Liberation movements that in spite of All Odds struggled and won

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think about Algeria the revolution of a million Martyrs you know fighting to be

33:06

free from France or Vietnam where two to three million Vietnamese people

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died uh but yet succeeded in defeating us imperialism or in South Africa still

33:19

an incomplete Victory but nonetheless the end of formal apartheid all of these

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movements all of these National Liberation movements they had the struggle on the battlefield between the

33:31

colonizers and the oppressed they had the issue of diplomacy did they have friends and allies were their friends

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and allies Regional or Beyond could they get was there a rear base area like in

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the case of Vietnam China and the USSR shared a border with North

33:48

Vietnam then there was the question of the second front so to speak in the case

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of Algeria it would have been the front inside of France in the case of of Vietnam the front was here in the United

34:00

States although it was everywhere else too uh in other words where the people

34:06

of the oppressor imperialist country become an active factor in their support for

34:14

National Liberation and sometimes those movements were not explicitly for the

34:21

National Liberation Front say in in Vietnam but they were against the war in some ways and the NLF the National

34:28

Liberation Front made sure to nurture any and all manifestations of opposition

34:34

to imperialism from within the imperialist Metropole that they that

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these National Liberation movements have a second front inside the imperialist countries in other words this sort of

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contemporary manifestation of internationalism is in many ways a Hallmark of our struggle and I think now

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in the last months it's become revived and practice ice and now we have to

34:59

conceptualize it theorize it recognize it as a major part of the global

35:05

struggle go ahead yeah I agree I think the the

35:11

analogy is is very apt you know uh I think in ways it's analogous to both

35:17

situations in a way in ways very different than both situations I think the fact that you have a diaspora

35:23

population right that has been effectively exiled from its Homeland has

35:29

produced the conditions for um Consciousness raising resistance outside

35:34

of Palestine right and that was necessitated by the fact that Palestinians uh a foundational aspect of

35:41

our struggle is the right of return that's one then what we have is also a

35:46

multi-generational struggle so you have generations of Palestinians that are being born in diaspora that have now

35:54

been forced to both understand their local Contex text meaning how do I bring Palestine here and also have departed

36:02

from some of the concerns and the fears of the prior Generations around deportation around being denied citizenship things of that nature so

36:10

that's on the part that's on the one hand even though we're thousands of miles away effectively as Palestinians

36:16

in the US or in the west more broadly unlike France where it is also a diaspora there was a diaspora Dynamic to

36:23

it there were algerians inside of the Metropole that were struggling in

36:28

alongside the left the French left in different ways uh to end uh the the

36:33

settler Colonial Enterprise inside of Algeria and Vietnam the the I think the difference being is the conscription

36:41

that took place facilitated the ra radicalization of American Youth and at

36:47

the in conjunction with global anti-colonial struggle Global and left struggle inside of this country the

36:52

Civil Rights Movement etc etc right and I think the similarity here is the role of the US the understanding of the role

36:59

of the US whereas the US was the primary actor in Vietnam the US in my opinion is

37:05

still the principled ACT is still a primary actor in what's happening inside of Palestine and so it's in a way

37:12

drawing on some of the various elements I think where we'll struggle what

37:18

differentiates us between us and Vietnam in the way that the the Vietnam anti-war movement uh was so critical is the

37:26

implication for people on a personal level Beyond

37:31

Palestinians and Arabs right where conscription facilitated that we don't

37:37

have that here but I think what we're and that's what you're speaking to your point that's what requires us to

37:42

theorize and understand well how do we actually sharpen these contradictions for the broader American public you know

37:49

I think younger Generations are seeing imperialism its consequences for their own lives their ability to afford home

37:57

to actually purchase a home which is understood to be a staple of the American dream their this amount of debt

38:03

they're straddled with for pursuing an education health care costs Etc I think

38:09

what we require is a a UniFi theory that actually ropes all of these things

38:15

together understands the violence in Palestine as integral to US imperialist

38:20

policy as integral to where that capitalism in the US functions and its consequences for the working class for

38:27

young Generations Etc and so I think the Palestine movement is a really important

38:32

opportunity for us to understand the international local Dynamic and to

38:39

articulate what actually ropes those things together what is the the global system that conditions not just the

38:47

lives of Palestinians but the lives of ordinary Americans around us it's the same system it just its consequence look

38:55

its consequences look different depending on where you are positioned within that global

39:00

system yeah let's let's turn now to us imperialism and its

39:06

strategic and tactical orientation at the moment uh you and I and other

39:12

members of the Palestinian youth movement have assessed this struggle over the many months but let's talk

39:18

about right now March 10th uh the beginning of Ramadan was also the

39:23

deadline for what Netanyahu said in the Israeli military would be the invasion fullscale invasion of Rafa so we're a

39:31

couple days past that now um the Biden Administration is

39:39

airlifting and some level airdropping material Aid to the people of Gaza even

39:46

as it continues sending Munitions to Israel so that Israel can drop American

39:51

bombs and use American bullets to kill Palestinians I mean that's a profound

39:58

contradiction but humanitarian Aid is often viewed and must be viewed in a war

40:03

from a strategic point of view because humanitarian Aid is not simply people

40:09

starting to become friendly to or think about humans there's some strategic

40:14

element within humanitarian Aid always in in the context of War so I want to get your opinion as to what the US is

40:22

actually doing the US the Biden Administration is also talking about

40:27

sending or creating a sort of a portable Pier close to Gaza for the eventual

40:33

delivery of supplies to people in Gaza meaning in some ways the US is saying

40:38

we're going to interfere with the complete and absolute siege that Israel

40:44

has uh put on the people of Gaza anyway where where is the us at where's the

40:50

Biden administration at what's your take on what's going on right now well we've seen two things come out

40:57

of the administration uh more recently we have this intelligence report uh that was released in the last couple of days

41:04

that articulated two important positions first uh and this report is based on

41:10

data collected since mid January and so it doesn't account for the last month and a half uh or two months nearly of

41:17

fighting and developments on the ground the report basically stated that the Israelis are not going to be able to

41:24

achieve their milit military objectives that they believe that the Palestinian resistance will remain intact and a

41:31

fighting force and capable of actually resisting uh Israeli uh colonization of

41:36

Palestine for years to come that was articulated the second they discussed the weakening and this is a surprising

41:44

thing to for them to actually release an an intelligent report about threats um

41:49

National Security threats they articulated that the Israeli government itself is on the verge of collapse

41:54

effectively that the ruling Coalition as it exists is unsustainable and that they

42:00

see the potential emergence of a alternative a moderate uh politician an

42:06

alternative to Netanyahu and his Coalition and so these two points released in the moment that they are

42:13

indicate to me that the assessment by the Americans and I think there's no reason to doubt this because we can also

42:20

see what the Palestinian resistance is capable of doing up even up until this moment is that the Israelis have no

42:26

Prospect actual complete military Victory right and by that I mean the complete destruction of Hamas it's

42:33

destruction of its capabilities both its productive capacities its ability to produce weaponry and its tunnel system

42:41

its ability to actually accumul sources weaponry and protect its people and

42:46

protect its soldiers and Leadership and so we've seen that we've also like if

42:53

you track this alongside what the Israelis are doing with Raa right they been signaling that they're going to

42:58

invade and in fact today yov Gant uh the defense minister for the Israelis uh

43:03

essentially issued a statement saying for those of you who think we have been stalling around ra you'll see what we're

43:09

about to do effectively signaling they're about to invade ra now what what's missed and what's lost on this is

43:16

an actual assessment of the israeli's militaries both its its equipment where it's at and why it's been stalling on

43:24

the one hand there's this talk around the possibility of a ceasefire but they've been planning and if they if

43:30

they really wanted to create the pressure in order for them to achieve uh better positioning within the ceasefire

43:36

they would have invaded Raa the reason is is they're in a very weak

43:41

position they're a huge quantity of their tanks have been destroyed we can we know that because the fact that

43:47

they're having to rely more and more on marava 3s as opposed to marava fors which are the more fortified tanks that

43:54

they have in possession we see this in the amount of brigades that are being

43:59

removed from uh the actual Gaza Strip and the fact that reservists are now being asked to come back into the

44:05

Israeli economy and so they're effectively having to prepare because they're not in a position to invade Rafa couple with the Diplomatic pressure that

44:12

they're experiencing globally the pressure from now including Gulf States around Ramadan what I believe is now

44:19

what we're seeing is uh uh we're reaching a peak of contradiction between

44:25

the US's assessment militarily their desire for them to enter into ceasefire and to prevent the Israelis from going

44:30

to ra is a military assessment it's not out of the goodness of their hearts that they see Palestinians suffering they

44:35

think that Israelis are positioning themselves for even further strategic defeat or further strategic weakening

44:42

and that is not in the interest of the US for the Israelis to be weaker strategically in the region right for

44:47

them to go into ra and not achieve anything and come out of it with a worse humanitarian disaster that the US will

44:54

be seen as responsible for and has isolated them on the global stage coupled with the fact that the Israelis

44:59

are not caving to their starvation policy the most effective tools the Israelis have used over the last five

45:06

months to try to attack the resistance it's targeting of Civilian infrastructure and the civilian

45:11

population and the starvation policy those are the and those have reached

45:16

diminishing returns that has brought the us into a position it doesn't want to be in

45:22

diplomatically and has weakened it globally and so I think that's what's animating the difference that's why

45:27

there's now the in this intelligence report against the Netanyahu government

45:32

in a way to try to scapegoat as opposed that as opposed to

45:37

uh uh as opposed to the reality that this is a shared strategy across the Israeli

45:45

political scene and so um I think what we'll see in the next few months is

45:52

likely an invasion of Raa or in the next few weeks at least likely an invasion of Ra we're not able to reach a ceasefire

45:58

deal um there's claims that um you know what I'll I'll wait for us to get into the actual like positions of the

46:04

resistance in negotiations if if we're able to talk about that but for me what I see is the invasion of Raha will

46:10

happen and the US has signaled it won't veto a ceasefire resolution if it comes through the actual un uh if they invade

46:18

because they don't agree with a plan for Invasion because I think they see any sort of military objective achieved with

46:24

Israeli invasion of Muhammad let let me let me ask you about that um the the

46:30

Biden Administration has a number of concerns one is its own reelection uh you could

46:36

see from the the the not not committed vote in Michigan in Minnesota and other

46:43

places in Hawaii it's like 32% where there wasn't even a campaign against uh

46:49

for vote noncommitted a pretty pretty sizable challenge for Biden at a moment

46:54

when he's already losing to Trump the in all the polls so there's that sort of

47:00

narrow Biden interest but then there's the bigger interest of us imperialism

47:05

and how it succeeds or doesn't succeed in this very important region of the world um then you have the the US would

47:15

like to perhaps have a different government in Israel not led by Netanyahu but they're not doing anything

47:21

on the surface that seems decisive uh to to make that happen

47:27

um and then you have you know what you're saying the the move towards an

47:32

invasion of Rafa still very much on the table last week in our show we went over

47:39

what Hamas wants for a ceasefire Hamas is wants the ceasefire it's the United

47:44

States that vetoed the ceasefire three times as you mentioned at the UN it's the Israeli government that doesn't want

47:50

it but it's a ceasefire with certain circumstances certain conditions want a

47:55

permanent ceasefire an end of The Siege the removal of Israeli uh military forces from Gaza um

48:03

how what's your view right now of the negotiating position of Hamas and also

48:11

uh what does it say about the situation on the battlefield you're basically suggesting or telling us that whatever

48:18

the Israelis say about they've killed this leader or that leader from Hamas they haven't basically succeeded at all

48:24

in terms of the the milit the anounced military objective of destroying Hamas

48:30

anyway let's talk about where the resistance how the resistance sees the next days and weeks and what their

48:35

demands are yeah I think the position of the resistance hasn't changed for weeks um

48:42

and that speaks to uh how their read of their own military capacity right their ability to resist the continued

48:50

Onslaught uh in the continued attempts to destroy um the resistance militarily

48:57

um there was recently A A leaked report from the war cabinet the Israeli War

49:03

cabinet this is just a couple of days ago by um an Israeli reporter his name is Barack Ravid um where he discusses

49:10

how the Israelis want to wait a few more days to see if Hamas will respond to

49:16

their latest sort of latest framework around the deals and that they are

49:22

considering expanding the Mandate of the negotiators should ham not respond now

49:28

they've articulated that the ball is in hamas's court Hamas has not shifted its position there was a report today I

49:34

believe that I saw that they've altered the they've responded or began to alter

49:41

the framework that the US put forward through the Paris uh conference the the Paris meetings But ultimately it seems

49:48

like they're sticking to their position and I think this reflects the read of both their leverage their capacity to

49:55

actually um uh continue to weaken the Israeli position globally and

50:01

diplomatically the role that Ramadan will play in that and U the fact that

50:07

the Israelis have no way further to leverage pressure on the resistance Beyond continuing to starve the

50:14

Palestinian population which is having its consequences which is why the the resistance is in talks for a ceasefire

50:21

but it's not reached a point to where they are uh forced to capitulate on any

50:28

of the major terms which are important because the major terms are a temporary secession of genocide so they're not

50:35

going to capitulate to to that they're not going to return to six in six weeks to the continued genocide and starvation

50:42

of their people there's no interest in doing that now there has been I additionally saw reports um in the last

50:48

few days of theis Le like uh um putting even further

50:54

pressure on the resistance in the Arab states by threatening to deport Palestinian

51:00

leadership hamas's leadership in Q and threatening that they would freeze their

51:06

assets like Arab states would freeze hamas's assets but that doesn't have any actual impact on the military position

51:12

of Hamas right that you Deport members of the political Bureau located in qar

51:17

that you need to negotiate with in in order to bring this genocide to an end makes no sense and doesn't actually

51:23

constitute real pressure and so they've noted these two things if you can imagine in the middle of a war a

51:28

genocide the two things that they want to use as ultimate leverage that the Israelis are optimistic about that would

51:35

potentially change hamas's position is deportation of leaders not on the battlefield and freezing

51:43

money that's not going to change anything and that signals the weakening weakness of the Israelis if that's the

51:49

only leverage that you would call for to be priced on Hamas then that means you really have no path forward uh to bring

51:57

Hamas to a position of capitulation um I want to ask you one

52:03

final question the the Biden Administration since October 7th has

52:08

sent about 25,000 missiles and bombs to

52:14

Israel uh maybe more probably more 55,000 or more artillery

52:20

shells so they've given the Israelis a lot to to use to kill pal Palestinians

52:26

in Gaza now they're airdropping humanitarian Aid a very limited amount

52:34

compared to the need in Gaza to prevent starvation they're setting up this pier

52:39

they say to bring uh to a maritime capacity to bring in supplies uh is what the US is doing on

52:47

that front does it have an impact on the ground in Gaza does it have an impact on

52:53

the resistance not at all uh I think the aid

53:00

I think they they provided 11,000 meals so a population of 2.3 million um

53:06

hundreds of thousands are on the brink of death from starvation are

53:12

experiencing a famine and so and they've in fact killed a few Palestinians as

53:18

part of this airdrop because the airdrop uh the parachutes did not launch and so

53:23

people essentially were crushed under the Aid that was meant to sustain them

53:28

and so that's been a total disaster I don't believe this peer has anything to do with humanitarian Aid um first

53:35

they're talking about it's building is going to building it's going to require three to six months and so in what way

53:42

does that solve this immediate need for Aid and the Americans know that if they

53:49

were to actually Place pressures on Israeli to bring in Aid they could it

53:54

just it's unbelievable able to me that this superpower has its hands tied about

54:01

whether or not trucks are allowed in to the Gaza Strip This is for me uh theater

54:08

put on for American audiences Biden voters in order to make

54:14

them appear that they're placing any pressure but at the end of the day I believe on in the grand scheme of things

54:20

the Americans and the Israelis are fully aligned on the prosecution of this war it just on some of the minutia that they

54:26

disag on some of the details where they would like to see the situation politically in the aftermath and what is

54:32

required in the immediate in order to position yourself for that aftermath that's where there's difference but beyond that there isn't this pier is

54:39

likely security related right it's a the ability of the

54:45

U in the post situation in the post-war situation to be able to manage and um

54:51

attack the resistance that's going to remain in the Gaza Strip has nothing to do with humanitarian Aid and I think

54:57

especially if you see in relationship to the corridors that the Israelis have created where they've essentially

55:03

flattened land in order for them to divide up the Gaza Strip in the long term to be able to occupy it permanently

55:10

whether through uh International force or through their own ground troops or whatever or through the Palestinian Authority whatever it might be they're

55:17

creating a regime of control and this Speer is part of that process that's all it is uh and I think um we need to be

55:28

much more clear in the way that we articulate the role of the US the US is

55:36

not in a limited sense or handholding or um giving suggestions or opinions

55:43

they're managing this war and they're managing it not just in the immediate but in the long term and they're

55:48

managing in a way that is independent of who runs the Zionist government they're

55:55

managing it for their own strategy and vision for what they want to happen in

56:01

Palestine right so Joe Biden really truly a partner in genocide if Donald

56:07

Trump were to be elected Muhammad from given the Strategic nature of the

56:14

Israeli uh relationship with us imperialism Uh I that won't alter I

56:19

don't think I think that this is a relationship whereby uh the United States the

56:25

Imperial power views Israel in spite of whatever differences it has with some of

56:31

the narrower interests of the Zionist of whatever stripe they see Israel as an

56:38

extension of American power and if the Palestinians win it will

56:46

inspire resistance from oppressed Arab and other peoples of the Middle East

56:51

against the US Empire so they view it really in a in a from the from the vantage point of Empire and from the

56:58

vantage point of classical imperialist U sort of interests against

57:04

the colonized people when they fight uh to try to liberate themselves the us could have said at the NBN Fu since we

57:11

talked about Vietnam okay uh Vietnam doesn't want to have a French Colonial

57:16

Overlord the bitter fruits of French colonialism in Vietnam were so

57:21

detestable that Vietnam had to be free from them but instead of

57:27

welcoming Vietnamese Independence and even trying to co-opt it us imperialism

57:33

took the military mantle from French imperialism and launched what we call the Vietnam War a war that lasted the

57:39

next 15 years anyway it's the global struggle between the oppressed people of

57:45

what we now call the global South the colonized and semic colonized parts of the world and

57:52

imperialism and it's a it's a fight that won't stop but Muhammad giving you the last word we're in an era where uh at

58:00

one time it was Vietnam at one time it may have been Algeria at one time it was South Africa right now the center of

58:06

that Global struggle is Palestine go ahead you have the last word absolutely absolutely it's

58:13

Palestine and I think I I hope this heightened moment of struggle for the

58:19

Palestinians and um the Arab world more broadly can bring Clarity to the rest of

58:25

the world on the necessity to move Beyond us hegemony globally and uh the

58:33

need to restructure the system and not just restructure it but confront it

58:38

essentially on the one hand militarily but also politically discursively to

58:44

alter the understanding of the the people in our locals in our communities of the role of Empire and who benefits

58:51

from it and who ultimately suffers from it it is the American working class that

58:57

is sent to die in these wars it is the American working class that is being robbed it's

59:04

their their their the taxes that are being used to essentially prop up this

59:10

military-industrial complex that has expanded its reach all over the world is at the expense of the American people at

59:17

the expense of public infrastructure public education Health Care everything

59:22

and anything that we're seeing is done in order to preserve Empire at the

59:27

expense of the people and that confrontation must be heightened and it must be done in a way that enlists all

59:35

of the different currents the progressive currents of this country and of the globe into one shared united

59:40

front in confrontation with Empire all right and for those watching

59:46

this show or listening to it uh Muhammad is with the Palestinian youth movement

59:53

that's Palestinian youth movement.com Muhammad if I'm right about that if people want to look at the uh

1:00:01

Palestinian youth movement website Muhammad thank you so much thank you for having

1:00:13

me